Can bush poetry survive?

[Terry]

G/day Leonie,
Having long been an admirer of your poetry, I may well have been wiser to follow your your example and kept out of it myself.

Terry

[Irene]

No Terry - no, not wiser to keep out of it!! Good to see so much discussion, and differing opinions!!

I agree with David in that we need to be writing of contemporary issues. Most of what I write would not be classed as bush poetry in the pure sense, but I believe I cover issues which are relevant to the world I live in. Personally, I don't get hung up on who does or doesn't like my poetry - I write for things I have a passion for, and hopefully, that passion is reflected in my writing!! There are people that like what I write, and probably those who don't - that is a fact of life.

I believe we need to just do the best we can, get our poetry out there, and focus particularly on writing with said passion, and on perfecting our craft - irrespective on whether it is 'bush' in the purist context. I am a little like Terry, in that I don't worry too much about what is happening in the future - although I certainly do my share on promoting bush poetry - because I do believe there is a resurgence in interest in the traditional rhyming word - perhaps not as noticeable in the city as yet, but if we write on relevant issues, I believe that will happen. Most of the people on this forum contribute greatly to raising the profile of 'bush poetry' and at this point, I don't believe it matters that it is predominantely country based - lets get the country areas enthused first, then let it flow on to the city!! The fact that there were so many entries in the junior division at Winton is absolutely wonderful, and bodes well for the future.

Perhaps the resurgence among adults that I am noticing is peculiar to WA - though I don't really believe it is. As Terry mentioned, Boyup Brooks sunday poets breakfast attracts upward of 1800 - 2000 people. They are there for the poetry, not for the music following, as there is a dramatic decrease in numbers at the end of the breakfast - until the numbers start building again for the rest of the days programme.
They also hold 3 other poetry events, and all of these are increasing in numbers each year, to the point where outside speakers had to be used on our saturday breakfast event this year at the club. Yes, a lot of these are country people, but by no means are they all.

If we put as much effort into writing poetry as we do into discussing the pros and cons of it, we would flood the nation with unbelievably fantastic poetry that they couldn't resist reading or listening to!!! (And I'm only joking with that comment - not seriously having a go at our discussions!! )

Just my humble opinion - for what it's worth!!

Irene

[Neville Briggs]

If we put as much effort into writing poetry as we do into discussing the pros and cons of it, we would flood the nation with unbelievably fantastic poetry that they couldn't resist reading or listening to!!!

Actually, I took that to heart Irene because I think you are right I've been thinking lately that I need to get into some poetry writing and spend less time discussing. Thanks for that. As the famous French artist Corot said, when asked how to succeed as an artist , " Take up the brush and begin "

[Leonie]

Good point Irene, at least this spurred me to write something new, so it's all good.

And speaking of being 'all good', that's what it is Terry, like I said in the other thread. Thanks for your kind comment about my poetry and please don't ever feel you have to 'zip it'.

And Neville, lost for words never. Goononya mate.

[Bob Pacey]

Write poetry !! who gets time to write anymore. ????


Great discussion everyone and Dave I did not take Manfreds response as Hostile just a statement of facts .


Anyway I'm off got to prepare a talk for 300 kids at a local school and set the guidelines for a comp for kids at a local show.


MMMMMMM My Favourite saying !!! " Just Do It ""


Bob

[Zondrae]

G'day all,

I've been too snowed under preparing for the National Folk Festival to have time to comment on this topic before. However, at Illawarra Folk Festival the Poets Breakfasts (three mornings at 8.30 am) the Poets always perform to a full hall. They give us between 1.1/2 and 2 hours., At the end of the poetry most of the crowd leaves and the next act starts with about twenty people in the hall. I have brought this to the attention of the organisers of the festival and asked why can't we have a little extra time. But they haven't changed it (yet). I still can't see why they turf us out to have something else on that does not seem to have much following at all.

As for the city/bush business' I am a city girl born and bred. I have tried country life even to the extent of milking a cow every day for about three years. We had over 50 laying hens and raised pigs for the table. I have been a keen veggie gardiner and used to say I wouldn't waste time growing anything you couldn't eat. But my heart always was in the city.

When I started writing poetry I used to say 'I'm not a 'bush poet because I don't write about the bush'. However, reading the definition as quoted by the ABPA I guess I am, and I wear my ABPA Badge (with pride) whenever I perform. I write about the experiences I have or had in both the town and country. I write to satisfy an urge. If other people like my poems I'm thrilled but I do it mostly for myself.
I write with rhyme and with metre (well I try that bit) because rhyming seems to be natural. To my mind it is the rhyme that makes it instantly look and sound like poetry.

[Terry]

At David’s request I contacted Valerie Read to ask permission to give him her Email address which I will PM him after posting This.

I Also copied and pasted the first few post on David’s thread to put her in the picture as to what all this is about; namely the poem Valerie had published in the last copy of the ABPA Magazine.

Valerie has tried to register on the forum but not being a computer whiz. had trouble getting registered, I have emailed her instructions on how do it so hopefully she will eventually manage to get that sorted out.

Meanwhile she has asked me to post this letter for her, explaining her point of view.

I will start a new thread as the original is now fairly long.

Terry

________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Hi Terry,
Thank you so much for your remarks re my poem in the forum.
It really is beyond me why the point I am trying to make is not understood by people who claim to be BUSH poets.
In my opinion Bush poetry is a wonderful example of rhyme and rhythm.
To say that Bush Poetry is only about bushrangers, kangaroos, gum trees, dunnies and red-back spiders is ridiculous,
and, I think, an insult to today's icons of bush poetry.
If we allow the current trend of allowing general poems to be accepted in bush poetry competitions (written and
performed) the day will come when this type of poetry will be lost.
It is quite understandable that today's school children have never heard of our old revered poets,they have never
been taught bush poetry on a daily basis as we were. My daughter is a high school teacher and bush poetry has
never been taught in any schools (city and country) she's taught at. (which explains why bush balladists have to
be invited in to speak to the pupils). I know that WABP never had much success with schools here in Western Australia.
(I'm proud to say that a school here bought my poetry book (Whistling Foxes) for each of its students, and I received
great letters from some of them). Quite an achievement, I think, from kids who have been fed a diet of violence in
movies e.g. 'The Hunger Game" and literature that has obliterated any deep respect for Australia's history, and the
willingness to learn it.
My mother in law recently passed away at 102 years of age, and could still, clearly and concisely, recite the ballads
of the old masters with great passion. Her delight when doing so, was what we have deprived this generation of.
When I was a student, our teacher instilled in us, a love for our flag, our country and our poetry, every day. And
we thoroughly enjoyed it.What a shame today's generation have not been given that passion for their flag and their
culture. Now that we are a multicultural country, we've become 'afraid' of expressing our Australianism and
Christianity, which may eventually be a factor in the disappearance of our unique bush poetry. Accepting general
Australian poetry into our competitions is hastening its demise.
It's a great shame, too, that smut and inuendo has crept into so much of the BUSH poetry recited today. I was told,
by a high ranking member of an organisation who recites in venues and in schools, that it was the 'only way to hold
the audience's interest.
I have, over the years, stressed that I am not biased against GENERAL POETRY. I enjoy all sorts of poetry, and
write it myself. I'm just striving to keep Australia's BUSH poetry respected as a very important tool in preserving
our heritage. It tells of our pioneers, our Aboriginal legends, our war heroes, describes the scourges of flood, drought
and bushfires, expresses the Aussie sense of humour, instils the old adages, e.g. 'help a mate' and a great pride in our
country and ourselves. It saddens me greatly that today's children have not had this privilege.
I am not slating the work of the the poets who received coveted awards in the Bronze Swagman Book of BUSH Verse,
(My own winning poem Brolga Dreaming is borderline bush poetry- having Aboriginal content). I enjoyed both poems
and agree they were well written. But they are not the material one expects to see winning coveted BUSH poets' awards.
I am a great admirer of David Campbell's poetry. His work is exceptional....but, his winning poem about Alzheimers
is not a BUSH poem even though it is beautifully crafted and emotional. It transferred his experience very movingly,
and readers would feel that emotion very strongly. This poem would absolutely win a GENERAL poetry competition,
and deserve the highest accolades judges could give it.
Today's attitude will ring the death knell for bush poetry, and all of us who claim to be dedicated bush poets should do our
utmost to protect it. No matter what is preached today, allowing general poetry into our bush poetry competitions and into
books proclaiming to contain BUSH poems, is the recipe for disaster. Why on earth are we heading headlong into the
destruction of PURE BUSH POETRY?
My suggestion is, and has been for a long time, that we could state in our competitions Bush poetry, (Traditional, modern,
humorous, General) and War Poetry, accepting that being dinky di Aussies our troops always displayed our renowned sense of
humour in the direst of circumstances.
In W.A there are many outlets for poets to meet on a regular basis and recite their work. Tom Collins House, for example,
is very well established here but Bush Poetry is not really on their agenda. These outlets have competitions and relish poetry
about day to day Australian life and run their in-house competitions. They are well attended, whereas WA Bush Poets
Assoc, is struggling. Bush poetry classes are rare, but when E.S. poets come here and oblige us with their expertise, the classes
are well attended.
It amazes me that we have lost the art of taking criticism rationally. I still maintain that the judges of our bush poetry are jeopardising the existence of bush poetry by giving awards to general poetry in our most prestigious competition that
states on its cover, and has done since it began, 'THE BOOK OF AUSTRALIAN BUSH POETRY'. Maybe those words
should be altered to read: 'THE BOOK OF AUSTRALIAN/BUSH POETRY. Then any genre would be accepted.
I reiterate that it is absolute rubbish to claim that Bush Poetry will die out if we don't allow general poetry into its arena.
It will die out because we are following today's trend of 'giving in' to defeatism. Bush Poetry would survive in its pure
form if all the energy given to allowing 'general' poetry to be accepted in our performance and written competitions 'to
give it a boost' were applied to preserve it. People come to our meetings to hear BUSH POETRY, and that's what we
should give them. Ask any member of the audience, if they go to general poetry meetings as well, and I'll guarantee that
only a small number would say yes.
If we claim to be 'Bush Poets' then let us be as passionate as we can about preserving bush poetry. If we are just as
passionate about general poetry, join a group as dedicated to that art as we should be about ours. That's what I've
done.
V.P. Read.

[warooa]

Thanks Terry. It's obvious to see how passionate Val is about Bush Poetry, but I can't agree with her views.
Bush Poetry is rhyming verse with an Aussie theme = simple.
One of the biggest enjoyments for me is reading quality poems by great poets like David C and Leonie on such diverse and sometimes difficult and/or unusual topics . . . but just as much as I love reading stuff like Terry Piggot's On the Western Shaw or Kym Eitel's Taffy Waits - both traditional bush/war poems.
I understand the argument Val makes, and I'm sure many 'bushies' agree, but we've got to be inclusive. And don't be afraid of the future.

Cheers, Marty

[Stephen Whiteside]

Valerie talks of the merits of 'bush'
And its value in our history.
I want to give it a mighty big push.
Her vision, I simply can't see.

'Our' Aboriginal legends?
Who, I might ask, then, is 'us'?
Did Lawson not write of the cities and towns?
I can't understand all the fuss.

Our soldiers died heartily laughing?
What strange sorry re-write is this?
Val's vision, I fear, is fixed at one time,
And even that vision's amiss.

Of course, she can hold her opinion.
It's fair she express it so free.
I will keep striving to write stuff that is contemporary and relevant and challenging and confronting and engaging and entertaining and truthful...in rhyme.
Like warooa, I don't agree.

[Stephen Whiteside]

Valerie Read's letter has prompted me to ask myself the question: What, exactly, is 'bush'?

All of Australia was 'bush' once, wasn't it. I can stand in the middle of the Melbourne CBD today and, without too much difficulty, begin to imagine the landscape as it might have been, say, five hundred years ago. Many books have already been written on this subject. Conversely, I also know that much of what I now regard as 'bush' will one day be transformed into urban environments - for better or worse. 'Bush' is not just about present reality. It's also about 'dreaming' - both past and future.

Driving home from Monash University last night after dropping my son off (shouldn't he have his own license by now? well, perhaps...) I was struck by a beautiful gum tree in the middle of a roundabout. It was surrounded by smaller native plants. The whole area was only about twenty metres across, yet stare into it long enough (perhaps only for a second) and you can feel the spirit of Henry Lawson. Only about a kilometre down the road is a landscape that I would regard as industrial and unattractive - though nonetheless vital to our current economy and comfortable way of life.

Lastly, some thoughts on the 'Hunger Games'. I have neither read the book (books?) nor seen the film, so I'm not in a strong position to comment. However I have heard enough of the commentary to speculate on what may be the appeal. Perhaps such narratives serve to remind us that our veneer of civilisation is paper thin, always has been and always will be. That is, in a way, a comforting notion. When we feel a sudden urge to tear somebody's eye-balls out of their head (yes, I still get it occasionally), we needn't feel guilty. It's part of the human condition.